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Betting odds explained 411 to centimeters

I am 56 and was recently diagnosed with DCIS on the right breast after I had a mammogram and then had a biopsy to confirm it. I believe mine is low grade zero DCIS. During the MRI biopsy, the Radiologist cut my blood vessel and I am now sporting a painful and itchy lump hematoma that is gradually and slowly in the process of healing.

Waiting for it to completely heal gives me time to do more research about my options since seeing the surgeon. My surgeon said that the area would be large and might cause disfigurement so that was why she thought having a mastectomy with reconstructive surgery would be a better choice… as if having fake boobs was ever on my wish list! But if I choose to have the lumpectomy instead, I would like to forego the radiation as well and opt for active surveillance.

Needless to say I want to stay healthy for my own family and to be around to enjoy my future grandkids, but I also want to be heatlhy enough to continue to care for my parents. My husband has been my greatest support and help so I do feel blessed! I am so thankful that God sent me to this site. So happy you listened to that nagging feeling in your gut and found this site. Thank you so much for sharing your story and reaching out. May we all continue to share, learn from and support one another.

Sending you healing light and love. Thank you so much Donna for your quick response and for being so selfless in caring about all of us that share a common bond with you in our quest to remain cancer-free without having to take drastic measures such as unnecessary mastectomy or radiation. You are an inspiration and heroine in being our voice and advocate in providing us with the latest resources available on the newest options and least invasive methods.

I will keep you posted on my choice after going for the 2nd and possibly 3rd opinions! I am interested in consulting with Dr. Silverstein and need to find out if my insurance will cover it. Looking forward to reading more successful results for everyone that leaves a comment.

Right here is the right webpage for everyone who really wants to understand this topic. You certainly put a fresh spin on a subject that has been written about for decades. Excellent stuff, just excellent! Thank you for the encouraging feedback!! It is vitally important that more woman understand the real situation regarding DCIS and support one another. Thank you so much!!! Fabulous to hear your update Kay! You are a ray of sunshine to me and to so many other women!

Thanks for taking the time to respond and connect. Much love and light, Donna. I am having a mastectomy and opted for double for preventative measures as doctors explain there is a high risk of developing it in the other breast given my young age. No family history whatsoever though. I was pretty confident in making the right decision about double ms, but having read this blog and all comments I got so confused.. Am I making the right decision? Is it too radical? Yes, it is all very confusing.

You are facing very difficult decisions. What is most important is that you get ALL the information and feel good about your decision — whatever you decide. I think it is very important to get a 2nd pathological opinion to help in making your decisions. There are definitely options to consider, such as what Dr. Silverstein offers lumpectomy plus reconstruction on both. I am curious, how was your DCIS discovered? Did you have a mammogram? Please feel free to ask me any questions or if you want to talk I can give you my.

Blessings, Donna. Although, there is no family history of BC as far as my family knows. Mammogram has identified it. About 2 months ago I sensed some lumps, which I thought were just hormones induced fibrocycts or smth. So once I figured did feel like lumps and not just a product of my imagination, I had an appt with OBGYN and asked him to check those out. He said he did feel those too, but did not think those were anything serious and if I wanted, I could go and have ultrasound done.

There, they saw numerous calcifications and did another close up mammogram. They then took me for ultrasound and by the face of a doctor and all nurses running around and looking pity at me I knew smth was not right. They immediately put me in touch with BS and said I should schedule a surgery asap. I already had markers in me that radiologist left during the biopsy. However, both docs made a disclaimer, the final post-surgery biopsy report is the one that is the most correct and actual. Core needle only extracts a few pieces, whereas the surgery reviews the whole breast.

Thank you again, dear Donna, for your responsiveness. I agree totally with Donna. The course you take is very personal but you have to be at peace with the decision you make, regardless of what it is. From your comments I suspect that your intuition is saying…whoa, wait a minute! You do have time to educate yourself AND pursue the other avenues Donna suggests. Also, read the books listed in this blog. I believe, at least where I was concerned, the hardest part of DCIS was making the decision on treatment.

Makes no sense. Also, the US is the only country that treats DCIS this aggressively and yet there appears to be no change or improvement in bc stats. I was 55 when dx. When I had the lumpectomy, the path was intermediate-high grade, comedo, estrogen -. However, because of the small size of the tumor and large, wide clean margins, I still fell in the range of lumpectomy only on the Van Nuys index. I made my decision, after much research and prayer, to do only the lumpectomy and major lifestyle changes.

Just remember to breathe and please, research everything you can find and become your own advocate. You will make the decision that is right for you. I just love reading your replies Kay! My goal is to someday have a retreat weekend for all of us to gather and share in person. How healing and uplifting that would be! Holding the vision! Back at you, Donna!!!! I appreciate you and sharing this journey with you. HUGS from Texas! I think that if mine had been the same as yours I would have seriously considered double mx.

Is that right, Donna? A 2nd opinion on the pathology from Dr. Lagios changed her diagnosis. His recommendation was that she did not need a mastectomy. She is older 72 so she decided NOT to have a mastectomy based on the new information. Its unique technology provides sharper 3-D images and better resolution than a standard whole body MRI.

And there are significant gains in both of those. The image resolution by the number of voxels we generate is three times that of what we had before. We also reduce scan time, which is less than half of what it was and contrast is about twice what it was before. In fact, a study by Dr. Bruce J. Because at the end of the day it is all up to YOU on making the right decision that you are at peace with. Silverstein for a 2nd opinion and all I can say is that I connected with him right away and am more at peace about the options and methods that he uses.

I will be returning in late July to take another mammogram and MRI since it is taking a long time for my hematoma to heal and Dr. Silverstein wants to get a more accurate reading from the tests. I agree with him and love the fact he will do what he can to cure first and save my breasts… and hopefully I will not have to have radiation depending upon the final results.

I will definitely keep you posted but just want to say my prayers are with everyone that has to go through this difficult journey but thankful that we have a support group that was founded by Donna, who paved the way for the rest of us to share…to care and offer our love, support and words of truth, light and encouragement to one another! Take care and God bless! My heart is full knowing that I have helped even one.

Blessings of health, light, truth, peace and love, Donna. Thanks again Donna for opening the door for all of us that were in the dark about our other options in regards to our DCIS diagnosis. However, if that was the only choice left for me and it felt okay…then of course I too would go ahead with that option.

Donna…Thank you for paying it forward and helping so many of us feel stronger and confident in dealing with our diagnosis. Having more knowledge is powerful but having love, faith and support sustains us and keeps us strong! Hi Donna I am so heartened to have come across your blog. I am in Scotland, Glasgow, UK and found an unusual hard lump.

Heard nothing for 4 weeks, despite them saying everything was fine on the day. Anyway, after sitting waiting 1. He never mentioned, grade, not that I knew what that was until doing my research today. He also said my next visit will be an MRI. They are now closed. As you know we have the NHS here and we have a huge breast screening programme for the over 50s here in Scotland.

Who do I ask for, a nutritionist, or? I guess I am asking, what and how should I approach the consultants as a delaying tactic so as to buy myself more time. Thank you for your post. It is fantastic and one of the best I have came across in my first research today. Hi Carol, I believe in serendipity. Here is what I just wrote:. Decision-making regards to screening, treating and monitoring of DCIS can be challenging, especially in the face of fear, uncertainty and confusion.

Have I asked the right questions? Do I know ALL my options? Or, am I feeling rushed, pressured and scared to move quickly? I chose not to have another surgery at that time even though I knew it was cut through and there was still DCIS there. The reason DCIS lesions are almost always removed is because there are no studies of active surveillance over time.

DCIS surgery is basically preventive surgery. Please take a deep breath. You have time. You are in control of your body and your decisions. They mean well. This is how they are trained. Bravo for you for listening to your gut and for investigating! I am here for you if you have any questions or need support! Sending you a calming, tranquil, peaceful light, Donna. I applaud you also for listening to your gut. I too had a lumpectomy but with wide, clean margins.

I had med grade and comedo. I am over a year and a half post dx and have never doubted my decision. Been super busy with work and grandkids but I always read your posts. Dear Carol—I am exactly in your position right now. The rush to get me to MRI, surgery, and radiation really put me off. The doctor made it sound like I was in dire trouble.

Then she tells me it is DCIS. At this point in time, I am refusing all treatment until I know more and I would say to you, DO NOT let anyone bully you into anything you do not feel right about. Keep researching and talking and I feel that radiation does more harm than good in these microscopic cases of irregular cells. Some table I read showed that women with lump removal only with no radiation had higher percentages of survival than those who had radiation. I liken it to old amputations because they did not know how about antibiotics.

Learn all you can! I just received the news that I have Stage 0 breast cancer. I have an appt with the breast surgeon in a few days. He has suggested lumpectomy followed by radiation. I was under the impression that this was the ONLY thing you could. Thanks ladies for opening my eyes. Feeling so much peace about my treatment plan.

I have no regrets about not doing standard of care. Wondering if you did mammogram, thermogram or MRI? Keep up your terrific attitude! During process Radiologist hit a blood vessel and I was left with a huge hematoma. BS and PS recommended I get double mx with implants. I was horrified and sought out information and was so grateful to see your website which was filled with helpful and important info and latest techniques in treating DCIS.

I sought 2nd opinion with Dr. He gave me the option that I was hoping for. Silverstein told me that I would be a good candidate for IORT which is a one dose application administered during surgery; they are running a clinical trial for women diagnosed with non-invasive low to intermediate grade DCIS. I went to the interview process and filled out forms I can withdraw or change my mind at any time but am wondering if I should wait until after surgery to have it sent out to pathology.

Maybe I felt desperate but wanted to be hopeful about the outcome. Any information on others that have had IORT would be helpful. Thank you so much for having this site because it really does enlighten, motivate and is spiritually uplifting because of the knowledge, insight, and hope that all of you have shared with the rest of us! I do know that Dr. Silverstein can be pretty persuasive and convincing! Thank you so much for sharing your journey and always being so encouraging and grateful for this site and all who contribute!

Please share with us anything you discover about IORT as well as your experience with the upcoming surgeries. Blessings for continued health enlightenment! Donna and all: I hope this info helps in regards to IORT: IORT is a radiation therapy technique in which a concentrated dose of radiation is delivered to a cancerous tumor site during surgery after the tumor is removed.

Traditional external beam radiation therapy for breast cancer patients typically consists of six to seven weeks of radiation after surgical removal of the tumor. With Intraoperative Radiation Therapy, radiation treatment takes place during surgery, lasting about 8 — 18 minutes.

IORT generally eliminates the need for external beam radiation therapy and the inconvenience of daily treatments. Unlike traditional radiation therapy, IORT uses a single radiation dose and treats a more limited area of breast tissue. After completing a lumpectomy, the surgeon inserts a special balloon into the cavity created during removal of the tumor. The radiation oncologists are then able to deliver a single dose of radiation therapy directly to the tumor site. Typically the entire course of radiation therapy is delivered in 8 — 18 minutes.

These patients wake up from anesthesia having completed not only their surgical treatment but their full radiation therapy course as well. I should have clarified that lol. No I have them in my jaw. They heat up and cause arcs that distort the pictures and can be pulled right out by the magnetism.

I looked into the implanted radiation balloons that are put in the tumor site while I was still contemplating radiation. My surgeon one of the top at Baylor Dallas Cancer Center quit doing them. She said they were having issues with them leaking and they were seeing studies that showed reduced success compared to regular radiation and complications to the breast.

Now that makes sense! I was just so elated to know that double mx was not the only option available to me that I was willing to have the IORT. I would really have to train my brain to be strict and disciplined in giving up the unhealthy foods that I love and grew up with! So I do look to both of you as inspirations and role models and in a sense you both are clinical case studies in being Stage 0 DCIS survivors without having to resort to mx or rads!

Because of your healthy choices in regards to nutrition, physically and spiritually staying fit and stress-free, I know that you and Donna will make wonderful nutritionists to guide and teach us everything about how to live a long quality life free of cancers and diseases!

Am praying for strength and wisdom in regards to this last choice of whether to have IORT or not. Thank you for your support and input! Will keep you posted and will keep reading for more insight and inspiration! Thank you for your kind words. You have to be comfortable with your decision. For me the life changes made the most sense. Thank you for saying I was brave but I think it was actually quiet the opposite. I was terrified of the radiation.

Every time I considered it I felt nauseous and an intuitive voice telling me not to do it. So, really, being a coward helped me make decisions, haha. Leading a healthier lifestyle was an easy choice. When I started working with my nutritionist I was fascinated and horrified at the same time.

I was already doing Yoga so I just had to become more dedicated to it. The acupuncture was new and I had such an amazing response to it that it eased any uneasiness I had felt. All in all, I gave to say that my life is much better than it was before cancer. So far, it has been. Its 3 am here, and I have insomnia…im 41 years old was dx 10 days ago with DCIS grade 3 comdeo necrosis.

I have 2 little kids 8 and 6,i have apt with the surgeon on Thursday and I am so confused and scared about the options and decisions I should make…my DCIS was found thru mammography,,i never had any lumps,,i just had pain around my nipples that scared me and a voice inside my head that told me I need to go see the dr..

I am so confused.. I live in Canada…sorry about the typing errors ,its just too late nd im not focused…looking forward to hearing from you,,amazing how reading some shared stories can empower us women…. Sorry I did not see your comment earlier. I can understand the panic, confusion and overwhelm you are going through right now. I created my blog to offer support and resources that I desperately needed but were so hard to find.

First off, take a deep breath. DCIS is not life-threatening and you have some time to make informed decisions. Mastectomy is not the only option. Please see info on Dr. I highly recommend consulting with Dr. Continue to research, get as much info about your pathology and keep questioning everything your Drs tell you, especially if you feel pressured or rushed.

The fear will diminish as you become educated and gain understanding. Listen to that voice in your head and more importantly listen to your gut. I went through all the same emotions initially and now I am at total peace with all that has transpired and I do not live in fear of cancer. I am healthier, stronger and wiser thanks to DCIS. You will be too. Sending you a hug and much love and light, Donna. Much appreciated! I will also listen to that calm inner voice in making decisions that will be the right one for me in my DCIS journey.

Hi, I just wonder why my post never show here,,,being newly diagnosed with DCIS grade 3, I found this blog very intresting and supporting…but apparently my post was removed??? You should get a 2nd opinion and I can vouch for that because after seeing Dr. Siverstein I was given renewed hope! Good luck and God bless! I saw the surgeon on Thursday,as usual doctors have no time for all your worries and fears to take in consideration and respond to.. I left from my biopsy with my husband and 2 kids and went to celebrate bcos the biopsy was not painful!!

I never thought a week later my world will fall apart!!!! I am not a person who can live fears and worries,,i have already anxiety and 2 little kids to look after…and school is coming soon…my kids saw me breaking down many times and this affected them a lot…. I feel so positive reading about women who survived many years after their cancer…but cancer is scary…. Nissy, I know it feels easier when you know you are not alone facing hardship like this.

I understand you as none else — how terrified you are and all the fears, etc. I am only 32 y. I wish the news came out a couple of months sooner, it would save me so much nerves and mental anxiety ;. So, it is NOT life threatening. Let alone DCIS. HOWEVER, this approach might best fit someone of a very content personality and who can well manage stress and anxiety of the dx.

Therefore, I myself opted for a double mastectomy although only one breast was affected. Then, I did it solely for a peace of mind. You WILL be absolutely fine and live long life and see your grandchildren and generations after. What IS important for you at this moment, is to calm down and manage your reaction to the situation. Because stress is the major cause of chronic diseases, and cancer in particular.

Below is the link to what it means. I wish I had it when I was first diagnosed and was going through the mental agony you are experiencing right now. As Nissy said it really helps us to feel connected with others that have or are going through similar situations who understand and empathize. DCIS sisters develop a strong bond of unity in support and comradeship as DCIS survivors…equipped with knowledge, strength, truth and courage!

Love, Peace and Blessings, Kat. I always feared the day but never imagined this young!!! I understand having a lumpectomy… but radiations is a very scary idea!!! I think what I will do is I will go for lumpectomy then do the genetic test to see if I am positive??!!! Nissy, oh my, you resemble myself so much — parents living overseas, living to please others, loneliness and etc. Unfortunately, cancer hits young women too.

There, there are 23 and 25 year olds with advanced breast cancer and way worst situation than ours. There, someone with DCIS is viewed as a lucky one. So count your blessings, Nissy. I do understand you well. On neither side. Not even among aunts or other extended family. I pursued another doctors in that practice to check it and he ordered an ultrasound, commenting he did not think it was anything serious, but sent me just in case.

I went to the radiology center for the US, but the radiologist started with a mammo first, then extensive mammo, and ended up doing biopsy and placing markers same time. I was terrified. Had to wait for a week for the results and it was the worst agonizing week ever. It was awful. I was single, had not a single family member in the US, was here on a work visa and on a very tight budget.

Anyway, fast-forward:. I rushed into surgery and had it done 3 weeks after dx. It was a traumatic experience, but more so mentally than physically. I do not regret I have gone for the double, as it gives me a peace of mind, which is important given my oversensitive nature. Four months after mastectomy, I am still with expanders at this point awaiting a replacement reconstructive surgery.

Cosmetic surgery is pretty advanced and I do not worry for the results. Actually, my new boobs may look better than old, but of course, nothing compares to the natural feeling. Grade 3 sound aggressive. I am moving on with my life. Living each day to the fullest and thanking God for every single day. I feel happier now than in the recent past before dx as I am so grateful for each God given day.

Experiences like these teach one to not take life for granted and appreciating it on a very different level. Yet again. YOu will be fine. Consider it as a bump on the road. Once over it, life will seem even brighter and more beautiful than before.

Find peace in prayers, if you are a believer. If you have questions, feel free to ask. If needed and if it makes you feel easier, we can email or skype chat. Take care and God bless. PS: Thank God, 2 months after surgery I was back to the normal life — traveling, jogging, going to the gym for light workout. If you opt for mastectomy, it is doable. I would look at them and burst into tears ,,fearing who would care for them if im gone…. I would love to connect with you via email.. I just cant post my email address in public..

I appreciate a lot you taking time to put down these kind words above…. Thank you all for sharing your real and raw emotions. It is so evident how scary it is for all of us initially and how little real understanding, support and guidance there is out there for those diagnosed with DCIS. It is my mission to create a safe, supportive and caring environment both online and off to help alleviate fears and empower women with information that can lead to better decision-making and happier, healthier outcomes.

Adriana told me any decision made from FEAR was not a good decision. She continually reminded me to stay calm, breathe deeply and investigate. Despite having a friend who was an amazing healing guru, I still felt desperate to feel understood by someone else who had DCIS — someone who could totally relate to the fears, anxiety, aloneness and craziness that I was feeling. It warms my heart to know that we can console each other like no therapist or wise guru can!

So I thank each of you for pouring out your hearts and sharing intimately. I will add to the growing library of resources! Robert Young. It was a huge part of my re-education about how the body works and heals. I highly recommend it! Much love, light and a huge hug to you all! Thank you so much for being a part of this growing sisterhood. I am so happy that Hopeful32 reached out to Nissy and they share a common bond.

I remember moving here away from my family and friends many years ago as a newlywed. And I also can identify with that sense of loneliness and homesickness. How wonderful is that! Eternally grateful! Thank you Kat! I want to devote even more time to help support our DCIS sisters and our cause! I do have a question: I wanted to know if Dr. Silverstein and Dr. Lagios figure it out differently from Dr. I spoke with Sandie and I am considering sending all my slides and report to Dr.

My surgery is on Tuesday, Aug. I remember you saying that Dr. Silverstein can be persuasive. Thank you Donna and Sandie for always listening, caring and paving the way for us that are learning from your great examples and leadership! I want to thank you-Donna and Kat-for your kind words and support.. I will have my surgery on sep I was so excited to try it as I started reading that flax seeds oil is rich in phytoestrogene that is not good for women with estrogen positive..

I appreciate all of your time and answers.. I hope some day I will be able to meet all of you in real… Hugs.. Hi Nissy, Sorry for the delayed response to your question here. I wanted to answer your question about why I chose not to have radiation. This is something that initially was torturing me and that lasted for over a year….

I researched like crazy and I felt desperate to find someone else out there that also chose no radiation. I came to the point where I was absolutely certain I had made the right choice for me despite even my VNPI score being 8. Hopefully that will give you some more insight. Would write more but I have to go lay down with my munchkins! My instincts were telling me that rads made no sense for me.

After much agony and research I made the decision to forgo rads. I became so well informed that I know they dreaded my appointments…hey, turnabout is fair play, right? In the end, all of them begrudgingly agreed they could go along with my decision not to do rads or tamoxifen. I had DCIS, intermediate grade, comedo with very large clean margins after my lumpectomy. One path said neg one said positive and they both stood by their reports. Which added to my confusion for post lumpectomy treatment.

Stay strong and do your research. The answer that is right for you will come to you. I for one think that is very important because that gives you more options and treatments to choose from that fits your situation and comfort zone. Well it caught up with me and reality came knocking on my door because after not having a mammo for several years I got the shocking news that they saw something suspicious and I had mammo guided biopsy.

The first oncologist is well renowned for his book on Breast Cancer…Dr. David Chan. I felt my heart leap with joy after hearing that and felt relieved. I was very turned off and depressed and needed to seek a 2nd opinon and thus I called Dr. I felt an immediate connection with Dr. Silverstein, who is very well respected among the world of Oncoloy professionals and is very well renowned…but he is also a kindhearted and humble man and gave me the hope and answer I needed by offering me another option and showed me before and after pictures of lumpectomies and breast conserving surgery so both breasts will be symmetrically matched in size!

After my surgery which is scheduled for Tuesday, August 27th I will also send out the final surgical Pathology Report to Dr. Praying that the margins will be wide and praying that I will be at peace at whatever the outcome… and will feel good about my next step and how well I choose to live my life. I wish that for you NIssy…the peace that you seek in knowing that you are making the right decision that fits your own individual needs and circumstances. Donna and Sandie are fighting for our cause and seeking better avenues for the right guidelines, great resources and less invasive or radical treatmentst for DCIS!

Loving Blessings to you dear NIssy in the decision that will work best for you! Know your body…pray and meditate , trust your gut instincts and be at peace little sister! Sorry was in a rush so I know I made quite a few typing errors with misspellings. Have a blessed day! As Donna, Sandie and others have attested to…most insurances do pay for 2nd opinons. I found out that Dr. But ever so thankful that Dr. Savalia PS did accept it. Thank you so much everyone for all the info.

Help stage 1 dcis surgery clear margins….. Now …the AI s. Is it worth it? Rad doc said not really…. Good health some ankle issues from earlier sports but all panels very healthy. Anyone faced with this? Hi Kat, thank you so much for your detailed reply and warm thoughts and wishes.. I am not convinced and they say it thicken up the skin of your breast that it becomes so hard to do mamogramms in the future,,,not sure,,,i am really lost in the C world….

I love to come on this blog ,because I love to learn more from ladies who went thru this.. I know everyone is different but it helps…. Thank God only my husband had to watch this and the kids were away…. I can see Kat how nervous you can be …I pray all goes well with you…as moms we want to live as long as we can to be here for our kids,,,my kids are 6 and 8…: …. Every woman deserves to live a happy healthy life….

I appreciate your support and answers.. Once he receives everything that is needed he calls you back and gives you a 45 minute phone consultation. Or you can get an Oncotype DX test. After a patient is diagnosed with DCIS, doctors and patients work together to plan the best course of treatment. Along with other pieces of information, the Oncotype DX test can help guide treatment decision-making in women with DCIS once the tumor is removed by surgery.

The test can also help doctors determine the likelihood of DCIS returning or the tumor returning as invasive breast cancer in the same location, also known as local recurrence. Since I opted not to have IORT which would have been given during surgery then my risk or what percent of recurrence is questionable at this point until I get my consultation from Dr.

Lagios…and if my margins are not wide and my VNPI score is high he may recommend that I have external radiation treatments. Just continue to have faith, stay strong and pray about it Nissy! God bless you! Kat… Thank you again and again…I had a talk today with my husband about consulting with Dr. I found Dr. Lagios thru some links and I know that I need to pay ahead around usd to get his consultation which I found really expensive but if I will get benefits its really worth the money..

I know how anxious you can be but I can tell from you talk that you are in good hands and you are lucky for that… wishing you the best on Tuesday.. Nissy, yes please. Mine is also linked to my name.. I totally empathize because I kept vascillating but once I made up my mind I felt at peace and am now ready to move forward! Lagios what he needs before your surgery date, because I was just about to do that and would have had to FED EX it to him in a day and he would have called me back upon two days of receiving it to let me know what he recommended in regards to having an IORT or not.

At the last minute I decided on my own not to have it and thus I will send him my final surgical report and whatever else he needs after my surgery to see if he still recommends radiation. You can call Sheila at Dr. Lagios office and she will answer all of your questions no charge and tell you what you need to send so you can send it to Dr.

So definitely you need to make the decision that is the best one for you and that you will be most comfortable with and feel at peace about. While double MX was not a fit for me at this time…I know that there are others that have been fine with it. And I was told Oncotyping was not appropriate. It was 9mmx13mm, DCIS, high grade, necrosis, focal. Because I am large breasted I told the surgeon for my lumpectomy to take a huge amount of tissue because I wanted a wide margin report.

As it was, there was a dot of DCIS found within the margin tissue, but not at margin. My affected breast is now a little smaller than the contralateral breast, but it started out that way, so, oh well! Because it was high grade I opted to have rads, but did interstitial multicatheter brachytherapy over 5 days, not whole breast.

The balloon catheters most commonly used for breast brachytherapy would not have been effective in reaching the edges of the odd shaped cavity the surgeon created. Wearing 45 catheters protruding through my breast for 9 days was uncomfortable and tiring and not for the faint hearted, but having rads finished in 9 days was awesome. I now carry a permanent seroma that aches sometimes but, oh well. I am telling all this so that those of you just beginning this journey will see that there is hope and light at the end of the tunnel.

I am 4 years out from treatment and my life is certainly back to normal. However, my life is a little different in that I search out and participate in studies that need breast cancer DCIS, anyway survivors. Some studies have been questionnaires. The most recent one collected oral DNA swabs and the other collected fluid from the unaffected breast looking for viruses that may cause breast cancer as the HPV virus causes cervical, anal, and throat cancers.

I want the causes to become known so that my granddaughters as yet unconceived never to have to worry about this. I am horrified for the younger and younger women being diagnosed with breast cancer. There already have been so many advances in the 4 years since I was diagnosed! Yay Connie! Connie- Thank you so much for sharing your story…bring hope into my heart reading positive stories like yours…I have ups and downs now..

I am not the same anymore until I do my surgery and find out…I am against radiations and I keep reading about the side effects and it terrify me.. I have so much to be grateful for and thank all of you for your support and prayers and friendship! I feel blessed to have found this website and I know that the Good Lord led me right here to find the resources and camaraderie I needed in my time of confusion and decision-making.

Wishing all of you good healthy results…especially with your upcoming surgery Nissy! I hope that you were able to connect personally with Hopeful32 because I know she can relate with you Nissy and give you as much hope as she has been living with! God bless! Please keep us posted. Hi Kat.. I am so glad to hear that you are back home and you sound really that you were very well looked after…!!! Thanks to Donna who sent us both emails!!

Donna, Sandie and Kay were my inspiration and role models who questioned, researched, became their own advocates and stood their ground on what they felt was best for their own DCIS treatment. I feel at peace about my decision to go that route rather than have double mx! Silverstein along with Dr. Mai and Dr. Savalia PS work as a caring and cohesive team and I am thankful to them for doing such a wonderful job! And I will definitely keep all of you updated about my followup appts.

But just wanted to give Nissy the heads up in regards to surgery. Oh btw my surgery was at pm and I did spend a night at the hospital and was released the next morning and felt fine just a little groggy and a little sore. Yay after 48 hrs, I get to take my shower today and will dare to catch a glimpse of my new breasts after surgery for symmetrical matching in size! Sort of weird and exciting at the same time. Lagios for VNPI. This is a website with such a personal caring touch besides the great resouces and information provided!

God bless and good luck to all you awesome DCIS sisters for your continued victories, good health, and peace of mind! Kat, you are such a bright shining light! Thank you so much for sharing your experiences and gratitude. May you have a speedy recovery and continue to share your journey.

Much love and appreciation, Donna. On the contrary Donna…all of you have been my shining stars! Kat- great to hear about your good news…I hope you wont need any radiations.. I appreciate the fact you take time to write down everything and support your DCIS sisters…the countdown for my surgery is starting and I am meeting with my surgeon on Wednesday to discuss a double mastectomy…i personally cannot live in the fear of it coming back. I commend you on your brave decision too!

I know that if you are at peace then it is the right one for you and fits your needs and circumstances…so of course you have my full support, hugs and prayers sent your way! Are you going to have the extra help available during recovery since you have young children? You know I will be rooting for you and praying that the surgery will be a complete success and recovery will be quick and smooth! Yes, please keep us posted as we want to know that you are doing well; and others who may make the same choice as you would want to learn from your experience!

She was kind and empathetic and shared with me that 2 years ago she opted to have a bilateral mx with implants and was happy with her decision since she had no complications associated with it. I want to thank you for all your support.. I am meeting on Wednseday with my doctor before the surgery…I want to see him to tell him about my decision,,however im still going for the lumpectomy on sep12, but because the MX requires a plastic surgeon whom I cannot see before weeks minimum I will never delay my lumpectomy..

I heard Diep Flap is better than implants.. I know either way it wont be easy on me but I am trying to minimise my chances of getting it back…I ve been having chest pain since 2 days now,,,not sure if its my breast or just muscle pain…im so worried with all this wait!!!

I hope you are feeling better…. I know that you are a very brave young woman and also too proud to ask for help…but I think in this case you really should either hire help or maybe see if a church or community non-profit organization has volunteers for that purpose.

I think even asking the doctor about the time frame you will need to stay off your feet and rest and if they have referrals might lead you to good reliable help. I pray for good dependable care for you and your family during your time of healing! Please keep us posted! Final Pathology Report was given to me today with non-invasive cancer and clear wide margins so I will not need Radiation!!! I am estrogen positive so will consult with an Oncologist regarding hormones but hope to lose the weight and look for alternative medicines.

My heart leaps and weeps for joy! My heart and prayers go out to all of you in finding the right answer that brings you the greatest of peace and healthy results! God bless all of you with riches, honor and a very long quality-filled healthy life! Heartfelt congratulations, Kat! I know how it feels. I decided to now celebrate my birthday on the day I got my clear path report.

It truly felt like being reborn with a new chance for life. Thank you for sharing in my celebration as I share celebrating your clear Pathology Report given to you also…that is such a fun and unique way to celebrate life…a brand new birthday in which life started fresh and with new and profund meaning for you!

Wonderful news! Look into taking DIM. It does the same thing as Tamoxifen- flushes the body of estrogen but naturally. It it an important supplement for breast cancer patients. Could you please tell me more about the DIM. My estrogen level is quite high.

I could feel I had hormonal disorder just by feeling crazy before DCIS , but my gen practitioner never monitored it dismissing my requests. It was around close to mid cycle and in general. My diet is super healthy. I consume tons of broccoli, cauliflower and drink kale smoothies almost daily. I thought it estrogen would go down naturally based on such a neat diet, however it is not.

I knew of DIM supplements, and have bought one at the Whole Foods to take to an oncologist for opinion. However, he said it is not necessary for me to take it and I returned it to the WF. I am googling and find various numbers. Also, I am a bit confused about the estrogen units of measurement. Thank you, Kat, for all the kind words. Life will be only better from now on. God bless you and everyone else. Thank you so much Kay! This is what I love about this site…the support and encouragement and now more helpful info for us to learn from.

I too would appreciate like Hopeful 32 to know more about DIM supplement and other supplements we can take to stay at a normal healthy estrogen level. Much appreciated. Thank you everyone for your strong bond of sisterhood as we go through each step of our journey to be healthy and cancer-free for life!

All of the supplements I take, with the exception of my fish oil and some Jarro products, I get from my Clinical Nutritionist and my naturopath MD and they are available only through medical professionals. So this means that such siblings would share In the situation described above, the The two relationships listed are indeed both in this range, so maybe this does make sense.

Sorry, I just realized I left out part of a sentence in my last post. Hi Tanya, to clarify: double first cousins are cousins who share all 4 grandparents and are not otherwise more closely related. The situation Mick presented here is very different, where a brother and sister had children together.

Those children would have only 2 grandparents. Their children would still only be regular not double first cousins, but they would be more closely related than typical first cousins because of their grandparents being siblings to each other. I have hypothesized that they could be a 5th cousin and 6th cousin through two lines inherited through my great-grandfather.

But that amount of shared DNA seems to be outside of the range of expected shared cM even for double 5th cousins. How should I evaluate the likelihood that we have a closer relationship than I have hypothesized? We have shared matches whom I think share the same lineages in common that are in the cM range, which seem to line up better with the expectations. Is this just an outlier result, or a sign that this one individual must have another common ancestor?

How many segments does your cM match share with you? Thanks, Nick, for your thoughts, and for expressing them so clearly for someone who is fairly new to this game. Of course, the situation I describe will be fairly rare and, probably, many people with this sort of ancestry will be unaware of it anyway. Over the generations, though, unusual unions will have occurred in many families. It makes me wonder to what extent such unions contribute to the range extremities shown on, eg the Shared cM Project.

Had I submitted my data, without qualification, to that project, would we have a different range for first cousins? Hi, Is there any info as to how much fully-identical by chance we might share, on average, with someone else?

A fully identical region FIR will be solid green. One further question, if I may, how wide does the thin green line need to be to be considered a FIR? Perhaps an error in speech recognition? I have collected my DNA cousins who share NativeAmericanIndian DNA with me, and am putting their tribes and trees and ancestors and stuff like that into a spreadsheet….

The more distant the shared ancestor, the more DNA evidence you would need to provide evidence for the relationship. Is that enough? These are M segments, not cM…. I am 75 years old and am so confused about my dna test. I found out recently that my father may not be my father. My sibling and I had a test done. I am Irish, she has none. Can you please help me. I need to know before I die. That amount cM is in range for a full sibling. Another reason is that ethnicity estimates are still a developing science.

Which company did you test with? I share according to Ancestry 64 cM in 5 segments with a bloke somewhere in N. He descends from Alice Dixon, a sister of my gt. The mother had been married before. Five weeks after the birth registration, Alice was baptised with the surname Dixon, and the father as Samuel Dixon.

My gt. So, depending on which is right — the birth certificate or the baptism, my match is either my 3rd cousin, or my half-3rd cousin. This seems to reverse the likelihoods shown by the probability calculator. Our shared ancestors were French-Canadian, with a single recent instance of cousin marriage, which also makes us 3C2R. How would you go about quantifying that likelihood? I ran it on your scenario and it only very slightly favored the 1C1R hypothesis.

Definitely not by enough to have any confidence in the result. Is there someone else you can test? Fortunately, there is another person and she just agreed to test. Same relationship either 1C1R or 2C1R but a different grandfather than the other. Thanks again. I will definitely let you know when we get the new results. At least weeks, possibly more.

How best to contact you with the results at that time? One more question for now. Perhaps the difference would be insignificant. I use AncestryDNA numbers over other estimates because Timber is, in theory, removing segments that are pileups. Pileups are unlikely to reflect recent shared ancestry, so we actually want to downweight them.

One more thing sorry. Hi, Can you please help me…If two brothers each have a child with the same woman, what relationship will those children have? Will their centimorgan values be on the high side of half siblings? Or are they just regular half siblings? How can you determine a more precise match? I match his daughter my known first cousin female at 1, centimorgans shared across 33 DNA segments.

I match the mystery guest at centimorgans shared across 22 DNA segments. My Uncle matches the mystery guest at Centimorgans and his daughter my known first cousin at Mystery guest father is the same age as my paternal uncle and mystery guest is close to my age. I recommend you read this post, then go back and read through the entire series to understand what the tool is doing. Thank you. I still had strange results.. Technically, we each have about cM of DNA, once you account for both copies of each chromosome.

Because we pass along only one copy of each chromosome to our children, they match us at cM give or take … it varies slightly by company in what we call half-identical regions. Those are the ones that show in yellow when you do a one-to-one comparison at GEDmatch with the graphics on. Yes, that makes those upper level figures a bit tricky to interpret — it seems apparent that AncestryDNA do actually determine the amount that is FIR as described in Figure 5. I think that would then lead to a bell-shaped curve at that top level, extending down from cM.

The lower curves then derive from that fundamental i. Sorry, I got a bit confused with the last paragraph not difficult I guess! The source of the variability depicted in Figure 5. If that aspect can be modelled that might then reveal the background Endogamy in the more distant matches i. Also wondering if the degree of FIR in a siblings match imparts some additional information not present in more distant matches. So-called false positive segments become more likely as the segment size decreases.

They are rare for segments of 15 cM and higher, whereas most segments below 7 cM are false positives. Current matching is based on a few thousand comparisons points among billions of possibilities, meaning that a lot is imputed.

If you compare the actual genome, your accuracy should improve dramatically, allowing you to go back at least several more generations. Because our genomes are Thank you for the article, Still trying to figure all this out. Would someone with Cm across 40 DNA segments possibly be a half sister? Her daughter shares Cm across 37 DNA segments with me.

Through a good deal of hard work and a great deal of good luck, I have finally identified my French-Canadian paternal grandfather. I have personally researched and confirmed all of the associated family trees. I even have a confirming Y-DNA match.

One of the striking aspects of the autosomal data is the huge variability of shared DNA amounts among matches who are identically related to me. I can think of a few possibilities, which are not mutually exclusive: 1 Your second cousins are actually half second cousins or second cousins once removed. I have a simple question, not sure how simple the answer will be.

The last table, however, shows that the highest end of Group C range ends in the s lower if using DNA Detectives numbers. Can this contradiction be explained? If the table is correct, why would three separate analyses conclude the range for Group C peters out in the s or lower? Perhaps the error is with the graphic to table converter geek power is really awesome but has its limits? If not possible, then she would have to be a half sibling.

The DNA Detective vet every single relationship, but they intentionally leave out the high and low ends of group, so their ranges will be smaller. The SCP also leaves out extreme data points. The AncestryDNA data is based on computer simulations, so they have a lot of data points but the accuracy depends on how good their computer model was. At cM, your match could definitely be a 1C. I have a concern though. We have more 3rd cousins than 2nd cousins, so if we get a match that is intermediate between 2nd and 3rd, is it not more likely to be a 3rd cousin than the figures above suggest?

To take a ridiculous example, if there were 3rd cousins to every 2nd cousin, I would bet that any match that was intermediate would be a 3rd cousin. Great point! Fortunately, the Ancestry simulations Fig. Which means that if the genetic testing reveals such a length the person is most likely in fact actually related to you in some capacity? I only have his name, no location, and his last log-in was in late Dec I have sent several messages with no response.

I can only surmise two possibilities: 1 a previously unknown half-sibling from my mom before her marriage to my dad or 2 a previously unknown half-uncle from my maternal grandfather child out of wedlock. So I do think the age factor rules out his being a half-uncle. I have a small family and all immediate members are known. No possibility of an unknown nephew, uncle or first cousin. Should I discreetly get my mom to spit into a test tube and send it in to Ancestry.

My full-sibling sister has just sent in her sample and we are awaiting her results. I hate the thought of never knowing who this person is. Would they be willing to help you? Her share with him might be a more definitive amount. Paternal half sisters would share the entire X chromosome. Sounds like yours is in the middle, which would suggest 1C.

FYI, the link to the online plot digitizer in your post is broken. This is a working link. I do have matches with folks who descend from two of my major lineages i. Yes, the strength of the match has me thinking that something hidden must be there. I have all lines documented at the 2nd grandparent level and beyond except for my direct patrilineal 2nd great-grandfather. Some more data on possible levels of endogamy—one of my unconnected matches has matches on ancestry at the 3rd cousin level or closer 90 cM shared.

Another has 48 such matches. A third, who seems to be LDS ancestry, has 67 such matches. For comparison, my dad has 19 such matches. It seems that the high number of matches among those DNA cousins suggests that their lines either were very prolific, their descendants are very into genetic genealogy which may be likely for the LDS folks or there was more endogamy than might be obvious from their trees also likely among the LDS folks.

Hi, I am a mom, and I share 3, cm with my son. So am I a chimera or is it just the limitations of the alogrithim? Amounts of cM and above are parent—child. Parent—child comparison can also be distinguished from full sibling ones by the pattern of segment matching. A parent and child will match on one of their two chromosomes across the entire set of 22 autosomes. I, being a female, share 1, cM across 59 segments with this person, while my Brother shares 1, across 63 segments.

He could be your full nephew or full uncle same probability as half sibling or your half nephew or half uncle same probability as first cousin. The reports also vary for 4th cousins and more distant cousins. Longest segment The results were a big surprise. The man that I knew as my father was not. He passed as well as my mother so I could not get answers.

My brothers had their DNA test and the are half siblings. I matched a 1st cousin cM range he put me in contact with his 1st cousin. He ran his test and matched at cM range. For a time I thought that I had found a half sibling and who may have been my bio father he has passed. My cousins grandfather had 3 sons two of them could not have been my father.

Any Thoughts? A match of cM is much more likely to be a first cousin than a half sibling. You might be able to tell for sure by using the WATO tool. So you are comparing a half-nephew against a first cousin relationship? If you do, then you descend from one of the sons. Another approach is to use WATO, which can often pinpoint what generation the tester is in, i.

This is what I have. I found two more matches. The probabilities of each group of relationships given by my recent AncestryDNA results differ quite a lot from the table on this website: eg. Similarly divergent results apply to all my lesser matches cM, cM, 52 cM etc.

Ancestry updated their probabilities when they came out with ThruLines. So does that mean that Figure 5. Hi What would it mean if my father and his sister share some DNA matches but there are some only she has not him. Some matches she has cm and he has 99cm this makes her a cousin and him a There are matches to people that have links to the 1st cousins as well as my dads sister but not with him.

My first guess is that the example you gave is a 2nd cousin or similar to your dad and aunt. Your aunt shares a bit more than average while your dad shares a bit less. By considering both matches together, we can get a better idea of what the relationship is. According to your chart, is cM away from the maximum of half uncle. I know is closer to the average for full uncle than the maximum of half uncle.

However, we have proven with DNA that my grandmother and my half great-uncle had different fathers. A match of cM is well outside the range for a half uncle. Your email address will not be published. Notify me of follow-up comments by email. Notify me of new posts by email. This site uses Akismet to reduce spam. Learn how your comment data is processed. Skip to content. December 19, thednageek d Comments. Shared centimorgan ranges for different relationship groups.

Distributions of shared centimorgans for different relationship categories based on simulated data. Figure 5. For example, between cM and cM, the most probable relationship is Group E, but the full range for that group is 65— cM see below. Best EJ. You can use AddThis. Pingback: Assistance Needed! Thanks for the extended discussion; it has clarified a lot for me.

But, here is my logic. Perhaps you can elaborate in a future blog post? I need to to thank you for this good read!! I definitely enjoyed every little bit of it. What do you think? Nice work! This is very interesting. Like I said, no easy answers. I wish there were. If one can speak of a number of centimorgans, the correct term is quantity. I applied these numbers to a family tree chart. Where can I share the image?

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Using an unsupported version of Internet Explorer be added here when they are available, with The official world golf rankings are set to take part ahead of week What to do now? Again, Dr. I continued to investigate options.

I felt inspired. I am so grateful to Sandie for creating a website to share her story and resources. From this consultation I gained peace of mind. So if it was there all along, was it not getting picked up on mammograms and MRIs? In his opinion, I now had 3 options: 1. Melvin Silverstein , 2. My San Diego surgeon had told me she would not do another excision as it would be too deforming.

Once again, she was recommending either a mastectomy or radiation. She said I would be a good candidate for a 3 week higher dose daily radiation course and she would feel comfortable if I just did that. He would match the other breast so that they looked perfectly even. He said he needed new images and before I knew it I was being escorted to do a mammogram.

I felt very uncomfortable and repeatedly stated that my breast was still quite sore from having two surgeries over the last month. Thankfully the technician listened and I did NOT do a mammogram on my very sore and tender breast. I was in no rush to do anything. I was there to gather information. The nurse brought me back to Dr.

While making my follow up appointment, I realized I had not asked an important question: If we did get clear margins, could I safely avoid radiation? I said I was getting conflicting information and that Dr. December, : My decision…. It provides essential information women need to know before making decisions to be screened for breast cancer. Like Like. Donna, Love your website!

Our American health care system is pathetically disjointed, which makes a gray area like DCIS especially hard. I am living a parallel experience. When no one could give me a sensible explanation as to why my treatment plan was going to be the same as someone with stage 1 invasive bc I went crazy on research. The more I read the more I knew that radiation and tamoxifen were not for me.

I am going with a holistic approach and have made extreme lifestyle changes to build my immune system, not destroy it, when I need it most. I do yoga and exercise. I feel better than I have in years. The Drs. I will be coming up on my 6 month followup in 3 weeks. I reluctantly scheduled my mammogram but I decided I needed to know for my peace of mind.

Will meet with the breast surgeon on Feb 6th. It was inspiring to me. Hi Kay. Thank you so much for sharing your story as well as recommending the book. I just read chapter one online and I am going to buy it! Please stay in touch!! Thanks, I will. Amazon is the best place to purchase it. I think both books are must reads for people in our situation.

And by the way, I was shocked and amazed at what I found in the medical community also. Even if in treating one, they create another one. Lagios and the Van Nuys Prognosis Index were a saving grace to me in the decision making process. I was going to consult with Dr Lagios regarding my path slides but I had already made my decision to refuse radical treatment anyway.

I just ordered Herbal Medicine, Healing and Cancer. Thank you so much for both recommendations!! We must continue to share the wealth of enlightening information!! I am awaiting approval from my ins. I offered to help spred the word! I also have an appt with Dr. Esserman on Feb 8th in SF. No more mammograms!! Curious to see what Dr. Esserman says. Stay well. Thanks again! I will put both books on my resources page!! So glad you found the books inspiring and helpful. I am going to be looking at alternatives to mammograms also.

I broke down and decided to have this first one at 6 months because I think it will give me some peace of mind. Will talk to the breast surgeon on Feb 6 and get her feeling. So frustrating. I started a cleanse class this week with a Yogi and my clinical nutritionist. It is a privilege and an honor to be your Mother and see what you have shared with other women going through this process.

May God grant you the opportunity to meet the challenges that are before you and all the women who share their experiences, and hand in hand we all will find the understanding and wisdom to seek the answers to make our lives better as women. I commend you, my beautiful Donna Beth, to have the ability and courage to unfold a new path and realize a destination not yet recognized by the medical community.

Oh, how I wish that I had read this blog a couple of years ago. I was diagnosed with 2. They played on my fears, being a 40 year old mother of 3 young children. Every day I wish I had never done the radiation. I know in my heart that the DCIS is sort of a bogus diagnosis, especially in a case like mine. Sure, maybe it was going to grow into something worse, but with a low grade, low-risk oncotype, 2.

Sounds like we had a very similar diagnosis and pressure to do radiation especially because I was young and had two kids. The one thing I want to say is that we can not live with any regret. The radiation supposedly reduces your risk of recurrence so that should provide some peace of mind. Initially, my husband was convinced by the doctors that I should do the radiation. He said he would do it. But then he too began to see beyond the fear and was grateful for my choice.

I hope through this site I can at least offer women another option and perspective. Wondering where you live and how you found this site? Also, would love to hear why you chose no tamoxifen? I saw your post on BC. I studied up on hormones, and basically by the time I met up with my oncologist, she asked me about the choice.

Komen sense of the word, but just surviving the mess of diagnosis, care, treatment protocols. I feel like I am battling the system as much as the diagnosis at times!! Anyway, I am happy in my choices even though I wish I had not caved to rads , and am trying to live a very happy, healthy life.

Exercise, eating very well, nutritional supplements, sunshine, laughing….. I try them all in my quest for good health. I live in Texas. Hi Donna. I have just been diagnosed with invasive ductal carcinoma stage 2 grade 3.

I have always sworn I would go alternative if I ever got cancer. However, I seem to find myself in a sort of establishment medical funnel, guiding me from one conventional tx to another. Since it has spread to at least one lymph node, I opted for a mastectomy. That will be followed by 6 months of chemo. The chemo definitely goes against my ideas of what makes sense, but like I said, I feel like I am in a funnel where the options are pretty much decided for me.

That increases the risk of uterine cancer. I will use as many natural healing agents as I can now, after surgery, and during chemo. Then I hope to take over my own care completely with only natural treatment options: lose weight, eat an alkaline diet, take supplements, exercise, get sun exposure, learn and practice stress-reduction techniques, etc.

I feel that I must do whatever I can to prevent my mother from having to bury me, and I guess that is why I am letting them take initial charge of my care. It is difficult to find truly effective alternative cancer treatments, since the FDA and AMA immediately call them all quackery and illegal. My surgery is tentatively scheduled for March 7th.

One overnight at the hospital and 4 weeks of TLC from my mother. Then back to work and I guess on with the chemo. I think WE always know what is right when we listen to our inner guidance. I hope you stay true to that and feel good about your decisions. Sounds like you are on a great healing journey.

Sending you much peace, love and light. Please stay in touch!!! We all have such similar stories. I was diagnosed in I am so glad I held out. I am now Dr. I, too, seemed to be more forward thinking than my doctors, BUT once I got to UC at least the idea of less aggressive treatment was not treated as heresy.

I also did and do a ton of research in the internet just finding Donna and you now and of course ran across Dr. Could you expand on the your active surveillance with Dr. Are you taking tamoxifen or any other drugs? Is it correct, that you have not have had surgery? I found another breast center now appointment next week who is willing to do an active surveillance, but I suspect I will be their first patient. Switzerland has only 7 Mio inhabitants, so the experience except for the traditional ways lumpectomy with radiation, mastectomy is limited or better non-existent and due to whatever reasons they seem not to be open to the information from the US.

Please let me know what your active surveilance encompasses! Best wishes, Petra. My spirit is back in the game. I was trapped in the funnel of mainstream cancer treatment and really thought I had no other option, that anything else would be suicide. I am already seeing an alternative doc who prescribes supplements.

He ordered a LOT of bloodwork. However, my family and friends are not so happy about it. Thank goodness my mother is on the same page with me on this! No tamoxifen. Now Jan. Bilateral breat MRI was normal. Had mammo 6wks post surgery, nothing suspicious. I was confident that mammo will be normal and I had decided no rads this time. Medical onc would take no for an answer about tamoxifen, he wanted to wait for mammo results. I meet with him in May maybe and my answer will be the same.

Even though I do feel that sometimes I have to defend my decision to some, most are supportive. I am at peace with my decision. I found this website in BC. Thanks for sharing your story. Wondering if you have had mammos every 6 mths post 1st surgery? I am happy that you are at peace with your decisions. That is the most important thing. Nobody knows for sure what the future holds, but we have to do what is right for us, for our beliefs and for our health.

Not everyone will understand, especially initially, but I hope more women will feel emboldened to listen to their guts and keep questioning the system and standard of care. We are the change! Keep me posted on your progress and continued peace!! Hi again, sorry about the typos. After the first surgery, I had the post-op mammo after wks like this time and then in 6 months and every year after. This time, I have only done the post-op. I mentioned to Radiologist that came to talk to me after mammogram about Aurora Breast MRI and he said that honestly he had never heard of it.

Thank you for the link from UCSD on imaging options. This was very informative and thorough. They do not have the motivation like we do! I have heard that DCIS can appear and disappear. Perhaps that explains the lack of evidence of DCIS in the lumpectomy. Also, to reduce my risk of developing future cancers, I will be doing thermography, not mammography, whether the docs like it or not. I was struck with the level of confusion at that time in both the diagnosis and treatment.

Essentially in medicine, if you are unsure of the diagnosis- ie how does this entity behave aggressive vs indolent , you can not make treatment decisions. We are now seeing some of the proposed treatments being scaled back, because in large part of women questioning the oncologists and surgeons. The core issue is that there is a lack of understanding of breast cancer, which leads to overdiagnosis and overtreatment.

Put another way, if treatment of DCIS were successful- it would lead to a lowered death rate from breast cancer over all, which has not happened. I applaud those of you who have questioned the diagnosis and treatment, that takes courage.

You are putting oncologists on the spot and pushing for a better understanding of the disease, which benefits everyone. Thank you Charlisa. You have articulated it well. Your support means a lot especially since you are a physician and have a deep personal understanding of the challenges with a DCIS diagnosis. I am certain more individualized treatments will come, but only when enough of us demand it. And those that must, will. Thank you. Thank you for sharing your story. I feel better about my decision to have lumpectomy only when I hear of other women who have done the same.

I will look into this Aurora MRI. At this point I am set on thermography. I know I will do battle with the docs, but thermography is at least as effective as mammogram without any squeezing or radiation. Thank You Donna for sharing your story.

I just made the decision today with my radiation oncologist not to do radiation treatment based on her recommendation. My core biopsy pathology report said DCIS grade 2 at under 3mm. Sites and stories like yours really are encouraging will only reaffirm that I made the right decision for me. I feel fortunate that I have no trust in conventional medicine, at least for chronic illness, so I am definitely at peace with my decision to do alternative treatment.

When I hear other bc ladies talking about eating cakes and brownies and drinking cocktails, I am just that much more convinced that I did the right thing. My new diet is very heatlhy, and I believe I will be healthier than ever as a result of this experience.

Neato dp4peace. I am currently reading the same book. And G. Should be here any time. Man, I do need to lose weight, though. Best wishes to all…. I refused the option and my surgeon dropped the subject right away. Contact: Emma Mason wordmason mac. Magnetic resonance imaging MRI falsely detects breast cancer in Five out of every Six positive scans according to new research into the use of MRI for women with a high, inherited risk of developing the disease.

Thanks for the info Gail. Esserman also pointed this out…. I am blown away that we have such a barbaric system. Since my last posting I found a naturopathic MD and will be following up with her in a couple of weeks. This is one of the things I will be asking the Dr in a couple of weeks. Yes, so grateful to you for recommending the Donald Yance book! I am actually thinking of going to school to study nutrition and herbs! It is fascinating!! Our disease-management system is so completely out of whack.

I am no longer affected by what the western medical doctors say. They mean well and they must protect themselves with the advice they give, but they are not educated nor trained in health promotion. So glad you found a naturopathic MD. Keep me posted!! Donna, That would be awesome to go back to school to study nutrition! Might have avoided the problem all together! But, no looking back, right? We do what we can.

I agree totally with you about Western medicine. It is awesome for diagnostics and surgery-the rest is nothing but disease management with pharmacueticals. Its so confusing and frustrating. Please Help. Have you gotten 2nd opinions — both surgical AND pathological? This is an absolute must!! Double mastectomy is a major life-changing decision that you do not want or need to rush into. Time is on your side with DCIS. I too was told that I would need a mastectomy and good cosmetic results would not be possible with another lumpectomy.

I would consult with an oncoplastic surgeon such as Dr. Silverstein in Newport Beach. There have been other women who have been told the same thing and after consulting with Dr. Lagios, their treatment options changed and were spared mastectomies.

Please keep me posted. How old are you? Where do you live, etc, You can also call me if you want to talk or email me at: dp4peace yahoo. I agree with dp4peace! I was dx last July and they tried to rush my decision also, which never made any sense to me. Mastectomy was thrown out there as an option but my surgeon thought I was an excellent candidate for a lumptectomy even with small barely b cup breasts.

For me the cosmetic result was not a huge factor. After much discussion with my husband and weeks of research, my decision was the lumpectomy no matter how it made my breast look. I told my surgeon to take whatever she needed. And if mastectomy is in the future, I will not do reconstruction.

I consider my surgical scars my survival badges. I realize that younger women I was 56 when diagnosed may feel differently. You need to know and understand your pathology, tumor size, grade, risk factors, etc. And most importantly, listen to your gut. You have to assume the role of being your own advocate. Time is on your side with the decision process.

They all agree with DCIS. Nuclear grade was 1 to 2 low to intermediate, perdominantly cribriform and micropapillary types with associated microcalcifications and no necrosis. I turn 52 this year live in Colorado very active not overweight and overall healthly. Oh and I have tested positive for both estrogen and progesterone receptors.

What has happened to her since her last post? Hi Connie! Thanks for your comment. How will I monitor, reduce my risk of recurrence and stay at peace…. I will be adding a new post shortly! Thanks do much for following me! Have you shared your story? Would love to hear more from you!! Hi Donna! I left you a comment on your home page and now I see your story told so eloquently here so I apologize for not having noted this part of the site first and having asked about your treatment when its all spelled out quite clearly here.

Thanks so much for your open sharing and creating this vital forum for so many of us with the same doubts and confusion. Yes, yoga, good nutrition and less stress is my recipe for my own healing. I have not yet decided. Thanks for listening and giving us all a place to vent, learn, share and celebrate!

Chrys, You are where we have all been. I did opt for the lumpectomy, but refused rads and estrogen inhibitors. I chose working with a clinical nutritionist, acupuncture, yoga and a homeopathic m. Just remember to breathe and do your research.

You have to be very educated to be your own advocate. They will throw a lot of statistics at you. BTW…the lumpectomy was a snap. Much easier than the biopsy. I had the surgery on Thursday morning, took off Friday, had a wedding shower at my house on Saturday and was back at work on Monday. Good luck, will be thinking of you while you go through the process of deciding, which in my opinion is the worst part!

Thanks you Kay for your supportive message! Yes, I agree completely. The decision making process is probably the biggest challenge. My friend Mary opted for the same course that you took when she was diagnosed this past February.

How long ago was yours? I may opt for the lumpectomy and I may choose to wait and gather more data first, and particularly find out all I can about this particular cluster of mine, rather than, like you say, the group statistics. I was diagnosed July 1, That starts the whole cycle of whether on not to have yet another mammogram. I just concentrate on my health and maintaining my healthy lifestyle. Hi Kay, i am very encouraged by your story and would like to know how you are doing now.

I am doing great! I am still pursuing my original holistic plan. I think that after the 2 year mark I may see about going yearly. I think I had decided from the very beginning that radiation and estrogen therapy were not for me unless the cancer turned out to be something other than DCIS.

I was shocked when I found out they were based on groups and not individuals. Adding to my frustration, I had 2 path reports. The oncologist was still insisting I take Tamoxifen. She walked in the room, introduced herself and then started the Tamoxifen lecture. My course of action has not changed.

I am sticking with my holistic healing plan. And I eat healthy and take the supplements my nutritionist and Dr have given me. One note: last month at my yearly GYN, I was told I had mild vaginal atrophy, so he started me on Vagifem, a very low dose topical estrogen. Because only a small amount gets into the bloodstream it was approved by the breast specialist and oncologist. They want to give you Tamoxifen to deplete every ounce of Estrogen from your body, then they say ok to adding it back in for the vagina.

I am using the Vagifem and it has helped with my symptoms. I can honestly say that DCIS was a blessing to me. It made me change and grow. It made me live healthy. And it taught me to live in the moment and be not take the good days for granted. If you can read those books I told Donna about earlier in the blog, it will help.

If you need to chat please feel free to email me directly at mk. Peace and hugs. You will figure out what is best for you. Just take your time, be still and listen to your body. Or would a thorough breast exam by GYN be as useful? Have read that thermography picks up bruising etc and might detect it as a cancer. Thanks for your thoughts. Have not had a mammo for 20 years and wondering whether to go ahead and have one.

Thank you so much Donna and to the rest of you courageous women for sharing your personal experiences and the struggles you have encountered in being diagnosed with DCIS. I am 56 and was recently diagnosed with DCIS on the right breast after I had a mammogram and then had a biopsy to confirm it.

I believe mine is low grade zero DCIS. During the MRI biopsy, the Radiologist cut my blood vessel and I am now sporting a painful and itchy lump hematoma that is gradually and slowly in the process of healing. Waiting for it to completely heal gives me time to do more research about my options since seeing the surgeon. My surgeon said that the area would be large and might cause disfigurement so that was why she thought having a mastectomy with reconstructive surgery would be a better choice… as if having fake boobs was ever on my wish list!

But if I choose to have the lumpectomy instead, I would like to forego the radiation as well and opt for active surveillance. Needless to say I want to stay healthy for my own family and to be around to enjoy my future grandkids, but I also want to be heatlhy enough to continue to care for my parents. My husband has been my greatest support and help so I do feel blessed! I am so thankful that God sent me to this site. So happy you listened to that nagging feeling in your gut and found this site.

Thank you so much for sharing your story and reaching out. May we all continue to share, learn from and support one another. Sending you healing light and love. Thank you so much Donna for your quick response and for being so selfless in caring about all of us that share a common bond with you in our quest to remain cancer-free without having to take drastic measures such as unnecessary mastectomy or radiation.

You are an inspiration and heroine in being our voice and advocate in providing us with the latest resources available on the newest options and least invasive methods. I will keep you posted on my choice after going for the 2nd and possibly 3rd opinions! I am interested in consulting with Dr. Silverstein and need to find out if my insurance will cover it.

Looking forward to reading more successful results for everyone that leaves a comment. Right here is the right webpage for everyone who really wants to understand this topic. You certainly put a fresh spin on a subject that has been written about for decades. Excellent stuff, just excellent! Thank you for the encouraging feedback!! It is vitally important that more woman understand the real situation regarding DCIS and support one another. Thank you so much!!!

Fabulous to hear your update Kay! You are a ray of sunshine to me and to so many other women! Thanks for taking the time to respond and connect. Much love and light, Donna. I am having a mastectomy and opted for double for preventative measures as doctors explain there is a high risk of developing it in the other breast given my young age. No family history whatsoever though.

I was pretty confident in making the right decision about double ms, but having read this blog and all comments I got so confused.. Am I making the right decision? Is it too radical? Yes, it is all very confusing. You are facing very difficult decisions. What is most important is that you get ALL the information and feel good about your decision — whatever you decide. I think it is very important to get a 2nd pathological opinion to help in making your decisions.

There are definitely options to consider, such as what Dr. Silverstein offers lumpectomy plus reconstruction on both. I am curious, how was your DCIS discovered? Did you have a mammogram? Please feel free to ask me any questions or if you want to talk I can give you my. Blessings, Donna. Although, there is no family history of BC as far as my family knows. Mammogram has identified it. About 2 months ago I sensed some lumps, which I thought were just hormones induced fibrocycts or smth.

So once I figured did feel like lumps and not just a product of my imagination, I had an appt with OBGYN and asked him to check those out. He said he did feel those too, but did not think those were anything serious and if I wanted, I could go and have ultrasound done. There, they saw numerous calcifications and did another close up mammogram.

They then took me for ultrasound and by the face of a doctor and all nurses running around and looking pity at me I knew smth was not right. They immediately put me in touch with BS and said I should schedule a surgery asap. I already had markers in me that radiologist left during the biopsy. However, both docs made a disclaimer, the final post-surgery biopsy report is the one that is the most correct and actual. Core needle only extracts a few pieces, whereas the surgery reviews the whole breast.

Thank you again, dear Donna, for your responsiveness. I agree totally with Donna. The course you take is very personal but you have to be at peace with the decision you make, regardless of what it is. From your comments I suspect that your intuition is saying…whoa, wait a minute! You do have time to educate yourself AND pursue the other avenues Donna suggests. Also, read the books listed in this blog.

I believe, at least where I was concerned, the hardest part of DCIS was making the decision on treatment. Makes no sense. Also, the US is the only country that treats DCIS this aggressively and yet there appears to be no change or improvement in bc stats. I was 55 when dx. When I had the lumpectomy, the path was intermediate-high grade, comedo, estrogen -. However, because of the small size of the tumor and large, wide clean margins, I still fell in the range of lumpectomy only on the Van Nuys index.

I made my decision, after much research and prayer, to do only the lumpectomy and major lifestyle changes. Just remember to breathe and please, research everything you can find and become your own advocate. You will make the decision that is right for you. I just love reading your replies Kay! My goal is to someday have a retreat weekend for all of us to gather and share in person.

How healing and uplifting that would be! Holding the vision! Back at you, Donna!!!! I appreciate you and sharing this journey with you. HUGS from Texas! I think that if mine had been the same as yours I would have seriously considered double mx. Is that right, Donna? A 2nd opinion on the pathology from Dr. Lagios changed her diagnosis.

His recommendation was that she did not need a mastectomy. She is older 72 so she decided NOT to have a mastectomy based on the new information. Its unique technology provides sharper 3-D images and better resolution than a standard whole body MRI. And there are significant gains in both of those.

The image resolution by the number of voxels we generate is three times that of what we had before. We also reduce scan time, which is less than half of what it was and contrast is about twice what it was before. In fact, a study by Dr. Bruce J. Because at the end of the day it is all up to YOU on making the right decision that you are at peace with. Silverstein for a 2nd opinion and all I can say is that I connected with him right away and am more at peace about the options and methods that he uses.

I will be returning in late July to take another mammogram and MRI since it is taking a long time for my hematoma to heal and Dr. Silverstein wants to get a more accurate reading from the tests. I agree with him and love the fact he will do what he can to cure first and save my breasts… and hopefully I will not have to have radiation depending upon the final results.

I will definitely keep you posted but just want to say my prayers are with everyone that has to go through this difficult journey but thankful that we have a support group that was founded by Donna, who paved the way for the rest of us to share…to care and offer our love, support and words of truth, light and encouragement to one another! Take care and God bless! My heart is full knowing that I have helped even one. Blessings of health, light, truth, peace and love, Donna.

Thanks again Donna for opening the door for all of us that were in the dark about our other options in regards to our DCIS diagnosis. However, if that was the only choice left for me and it felt okay…then of course I too would go ahead with that option. Donna…Thank you for paying it forward and helping so many of us feel stronger and confident in dealing with our diagnosis. Having more knowledge is powerful but having love, faith and support sustains us and keeps us strong!

Hi Donna I am so heartened to have come across your blog. I am in Scotland, Glasgow, UK and found an unusual hard lump. Heard nothing for 4 weeks, despite them saying everything was fine on the day. Anyway, after sitting waiting 1. He never mentioned, grade, not that I knew what that was until doing my research today.

He also said my next visit will be an MRI. They are now closed. As you know we have the NHS here and we have a huge breast screening programme for the over 50s here in Scotland. Who do I ask for, a nutritionist, or? I guess I am asking, what and how should I approach the consultants as a delaying tactic so as to buy myself more time. Thank you for your post. It is fantastic and one of the best I have came across in my first research today. Hi Carol, I believe in serendipity.

Here is what I just wrote:. Decision-making regards to screening, treating and monitoring of DCIS can be challenging, especially in the face of fear, uncertainty and confusion. Have I asked the right questions? Do I know ALL my options?

Or, am I feeling rushed, pressured and scared to move quickly? I chose not to have another surgery at that time even though I knew it was cut through and there was still DCIS there. The reason DCIS lesions are almost always removed is because there are no studies of active surveillance over time. DCIS surgery is basically preventive surgery. Please take a deep breath. You have time. You are in control of your body and your decisions. They mean well. This is how they are trained. Bravo for you for listening to your gut and for investigating!

I am here for you if you have any questions or need support! Sending you a calming, tranquil, peaceful light, Donna. I applaud you also for listening to your gut. I too had a lumpectomy but with wide, clean margins. I had med grade and comedo. I am over a year and a half post dx and have never doubted my decision.

Been super busy with work and grandkids but I always read your posts. Dear Carol—I am exactly in your position right now. The rush to get me to MRI, surgery, and radiation really put me off. The doctor made it sound like I was in dire trouble. Then she tells me it is DCIS. At this point in time, I am refusing all treatment until I know more and I would say to you, DO NOT let anyone bully you into anything you do not feel right about. Keep researching and talking and I feel that radiation does more harm than good in these microscopic cases of irregular cells.

Some table I read showed that women with lump removal only with no radiation had higher percentages of survival than those who had radiation. I liken it to old amputations because they did not know how about antibiotics. Learn all you can! I just received the news that I have Stage 0 breast cancer.

I have an appt with the breast surgeon in a few days. He has suggested lumpectomy followed by radiation. I was under the impression that this was the ONLY thing you could. Thanks ladies for opening my eyes. Feeling so much peace about my treatment plan. I have no regrets about not doing standard of care. Wondering if you did mammogram, thermogram or MRI? Keep up your terrific attitude! During process Radiologist hit a blood vessel and I was left with a huge hematoma.

BS and PS recommended I get double mx with implants. I was horrified and sought out information and was so grateful to see your website which was filled with helpful and important info and latest techniques in treating DCIS. I sought 2nd opinion with Dr. He gave me the option that I was hoping for. Silverstein told me that I would be a good candidate for IORT which is a one dose application administered during surgery; they are running a clinical trial for women diagnosed with non-invasive low to intermediate grade DCIS.

I went to the interview process and filled out forms I can withdraw or change my mind at any time but am wondering if I should wait until after surgery to have it sent out to pathology. Maybe I felt desperate but wanted to be hopeful about the outcome.

Any information on others that have had IORT would be helpful. Thank you so much for having this site because it really does enlighten, motivate and is spiritually uplifting because of the knowledge, insight, and hope that all of you have shared with the rest of us! I do know that Dr. Silverstein can be pretty persuasive and convincing! Thank you so much for sharing your journey and always being so encouraging and grateful for this site and all who contribute!

Please share with us anything you discover about IORT as well as your experience with the upcoming surgeries. Blessings for continued health enlightenment! Donna and all: I hope this info helps in regards to IORT: IORT is a radiation therapy technique in which a concentrated dose of radiation is delivered to a cancerous tumor site during surgery after the tumor is removed.

Traditional external beam radiation therapy for breast cancer patients typically consists of six to seven weeks of radiation after surgical removal of the tumor. With Intraoperative Radiation Therapy, radiation treatment takes place during surgery, lasting about 8 — 18 minutes. IORT generally eliminates the need for external beam radiation therapy and the inconvenience of daily treatments. Unlike traditional radiation therapy, IORT uses a single radiation dose and treats a more limited area of breast tissue.

After completing a lumpectomy, the surgeon inserts a special balloon into the cavity created during removal of the tumor. The radiation oncologists are then able to deliver a single dose of radiation therapy directly to the tumor site. Typically the entire course of radiation therapy is delivered in 8 — 18 minutes. These patients wake up from anesthesia having completed not only their surgical treatment but their full radiation therapy course as well. I should have clarified that lol.

No I have them in my jaw. They heat up and cause arcs that distort the pictures and can be pulled right out by the magnetism. I looked into the implanted radiation balloons that are put in the tumor site while I was still contemplating radiation. My surgeon one of the top at Baylor Dallas Cancer Center quit doing them. She said they were having issues with them leaking and they were seeing studies that showed reduced success compared to regular radiation and complications to the breast.

Now that makes sense! I was just so elated to know that double mx was not the only option available to me that I was willing to have the IORT. I would really have to train my brain to be strict and disciplined in giving up the unhealthy foods that I love and grew up with! So I do look to both of you as inspirations and role models and in a sense you both are clinical case studies in being Stage 0 DCIS survivors without having to resort to mx or rads!

Because of your healthy choices in regards to nutrition, physically and spiritually staying fit and stress-free, I know that you and Donna will make wonderful nutritionists to guide and teach us everything about how to live a long quality life free of cancers and diseases!

Am praying for strength and wisdom in regards to this last choice of whether to have IORT or not. Thank you for your support and input! Will keep you posted and will keep reading for more insight and inspiration! Thank you for your kind words.

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Poston fired a lights-out 8-under-par 62 on the final round to claim his first PGA Tour title. When is the Wyndham Championship in ? Racing 3x at min. The latest odds will be added here when they are available, together with our expert betting tips and predictions. Using this information to contravene any law or statute is prohibited. But the American has been great of late, going T, T and T over his last three starts.

Visit operator for details. The tournament was founded in as the Greater Greensboro Open. Paige VanZant is hoping to set social media ablaze — again. You can choose between the wide variety of sports tournaments, leagues, and matches available to you on a daily basis. Wyndham Championship Winner. We can certainly expect to see far more red numbers this week as well, as Sedgefield, a Donald Ross track that plays to a par 70 and tips out at only 7, yards, has produced winning scores of 20 under or better for the last four years.

Please upgrade to Internet Explorer 11 or use a It's so easy to build your own selections. The Wyndham Championship is August 13th to the 16th, Golf expert Sam Eaton is back with a 3-ball parlay from the second day of the Wyndham Championship.

You are using an unsupported version of Internet Explorer. Please visit gambleaware. Joaquin Niemann had no regrets about the 18th hole at the Sony Open. Those are just some of his recent big returns. The betting favorite is … ''It was a good way to finish,'' Niemann said.

All rights reserved. Top 20 Simpson occupies the No. Brooks Koepka. Watch PGA Championship live coverage. Moore ended his season with a missed cut at the Wyndham Championship and then a WD during round one the first Playoff event. The model had … odds of 1. Our three top 10 selections are all good enough to win this tournament and they should give punters a good sight over the four days of competition play.

Odds from DraftKings. Wyndham Championship Picks and Predictions. Wyndham Championship Mid-tier odds. Oddsmakers seem to believe that Koepka will rebound after a forgettable Sunday performance at the PGA, where he failed to back up his controversial comments following the third round. The Wyndham Championship is set to take place from the 10th to the 15th of August.

Latest Wyndham Championship Odds. Looking to put some money down? That was one of many huge calls he made last year. Here is a look at outright winner Wyndham odds. Four days after a pair of pars on the final hole at Kapalua led to a playoff loss, Niemann holed a foot chip for eagle on the 18th hole Thursday for an 8-under 62 and a share of the lead with Jason Kokrak and Peter Malnati.

Poston became the first player on the tour since Lee Trevino in to win a hole tournament without making any bogeys or worse. With years of experience as a UK bookmaker, we offer great odds and live golf results that will keep fans of the game like you in the game. Ancer finished second at the RBC Heritage back in June to Webb Simpson — a course, tournament and leaderboard that closely resembles the Wyndham Championship each year.

Don't agree?! Live betting is an exhilarating way to watch golf. The tournament tees off on August The year-old has had four hole leads on the season, including in two of his last five tournaments. Sam Eaton. Can I legally bet on the Wyndham Championship? The Wyndham Championship is a tournament that can create an upset. Todd has been excellent in the campaign, notching victories at the Mayakoba Golf Classic and the Bermuda Championship. The South Korean held a two-shot lead after 54 holes at the Wyndham Championship after opening , but Jim Herman edged him with his final-round Step 2 — Use your golf knowledge and punter insight to work through what key skills will be required to win this tournament.

Check out our tips too! Take a look at our predictions, picks, and the latest odds for The American Express, starting January 21 and ending January How should I evaluate the likelihood that we have a closer relationship than I have hypothesized? We have shared matches whom I think share the same lineages in common that are in the cM range, which seem to line up better with the expectations. Is this just an outlier result, or a sign that this one individual must have another common ancestor?

How many segments does your cM match share with you? Thanks, Nick, for your thoughts, and for expressing them so clearly for someone who is fairly new to this game. Of course, the situation I describe will be fairly rare and, probably, many people with this sort of ancestry will be unaware of it anyway. Over the generations, though, unusual unions will have occurred in many families. It makes me wonder to what extent such unions contribute to the range extremities shown on, eg the Shared cM Project.

Had I submitted my data, without qualification, to that project, would we have a different range for first cousins? Hi, Is there any info as to how much fully-identical by chance we might share, on average, with someone else? A fully identical region FIR will be solid green. One further question, if I may, how wide does the thin green line need to be to be considered a FIR?

Perhaps an error in speech recognition? I have collected my DNA cousins who share NativeAmericanIndian DNA with me, and am putting their tribes and trees and ancestors and stuff like that into a spreadsheet…. The more distant the shared ancestor, the more DNA evidence you would need to provide evidence for the relationship. Is that enough? These are M segments, not cM…. I am 75 years old and am so confused about my dna test.

I found out recently that my father may not be my father. My sibling and I had a test done. I am Irish, she has none. Can you please help me. I need to know before I die. That amount cM is in range for a full sibling.

Another reason is that ethnicity estimates are still a developing science. Which company did you test with? I share according to Ancestry 64 cM in 5 segments with a bloke somewhere in N. He descends from Alice Dixon, a sister of my gt. The mother had been married before. Five weeks after the birth registration, Alice was baptised with the surname Dixon, and the father as Samuel Dixon. My gt. So, depending on which is right — the birth certificate or the baptism, my match is either my 3rd cousin, or my half-3rd cousin.

This seems to reverse the likelihoods shown by the probability calculator. Our shared ancestors were French-Canadian, with a single recent instance of cousin marriage, which also makes us 3C2R. How would you go about quantifying that likelihood? I ran it on your scenario and it only very slightly favored the 1C1R hypothesis. Definitely not by enough to have any confidence in the result. Is there someone else you can test?

Fortunately, there is another person and she just agreed to test. Same relationship either 1C1R or 2C1R but a different grandfather than the other. Thanks again. I will definitely let you know when we get the new results. At least weeks, possibly more. How best to contact you with the results at that time? One more question for now. Perhaps the difference would be insignificant. I use AncestryDNA numbers over other estimates because Timber is, in theory, removing segments that are pileups.

Pileups are unlikely to reflect recent shared ancestry, so we actually want to downweight them. One more thing sorry. Hi, Can you please help me…If two brothers each have a child with the same woman, what relationship will those children have? Will their centimorgan values be on the high side of half siblings? Or are they just regular half siblings? How can you determine a more precise match? I match his daughter my known first cousin female at 1, centimorgans shared across 33 DNA segments.

I match the mystery guest at centimorgans shared across 22 DNA segments. My Uncle matches the mystery guest at Centimorgans and his daughter my known first cousin at Mystery guest father is the same age as my paternal uncle and mystery guest is close to my age.

I recommend you read this post, then go back and read through the entire series to understand what the tool is doing. Thank you. I still had strange results.. Technically, we each have about cM of DNA, once you account for both copies of each chromosome. Because we pass along only one copy of each chromosome to our children, they match us at cM give or take … it varies slightly by company in what we call half-identical regions.

Those are the ones that show in yellow when you do a one-to-one comparison at GEDmatch with the graphics on. Yes, that makes those upper level figures a bit tricky to interpret — it seems apparent that AncestryDNA do actually determine the amount that is FIR as described in Figure 5. I think that would then lead to a bell-shaped curve at that top level, extending down from cM. The lower curves then derive from that fundamental i. Sorry, I got a bit confused with the last paragraph not difficult I guess!

The source of the variability depicted in Figure 5. If that aspect can be modelled that might then reveal the background Endogamy in the more distant matches i. Also wondering if the degree of FIR in a siblings match imparts some additional information not present in more distant matches.

So-called false positive segments become more likely as the segment size decreases. They are rare for segments of 15 cM and higher, whereas most segments below 7 cM are false positives. Current matching is based on a few thousand comparisons points among billions of possibilities, meaning that a lot is imputed.

If you compare the actual genome, your accuracy should improve dramatically, allowing you to go back at least several more generations. Because our genomes are Thank you for the article, Still trying to figure all this out. Would someone with Cm across 40 DNA segments possibly be a half sister? Her daughter shares Cm across 37 DNA segments with me. Through a good deal of hard work and a great deal of good luck, I have finally identified my French-Canadian paternal grandfather.

I have personally researched and confirmed all of the associated family trees. I even have a confirming Y-DNA match. One of the striking aspects of the autosomal data is the huge variability of shared DNA amounts among matches who are identically related to me. I can think of a few possibilities, which are not mutually exclusive: 1 Your second cousins are actually half second cousins or second cousins once removed.

I have a simple question, not sure how simple the answer will be. The last table, however, shows that the highest end of Group C range ends in the s lower if using DNA Detectives numbers. Can this contradiction be explained? If the table is correct, why would three separate analyses conclude the range for Group C peters out in the s or lower?

Perhaps the error is with the graphic to table converter geek power is really awesome but has its limits? If not possible, then she would have to be a half sibling. The DNA Detective vet every single relationship, but they intentionally leave out the high and low ends of group, so their ranges will be smaller. The SCP also leaves out extreme data points. The AncestryDNA data is based on computer simulations, so they have a lot of data points but the accuracy depends on how good their computer model was.

At cM, your match could definitely be a 1C. I have a concern though. We have more 3rd cousins than 2nd cousins, so if we get a match that is intermediate between 2nd and 3rd, is it not more likely to be a 3rd cousin than the figures above suggest? To take a ridiculous example, if there were 3rd cousins to every 2nd cousin, I would bet that any match that was intermediate would be a 3rd cousin.

Great point! Fortunately, the Ancestry simulations Fig. Which means that if the genetic testing reveals such a length the person is most likely in fact actually related to you in some capacity? I only have his name, no location, and his last log-in was in late Dec I have sent several messages with no response.

I can only surmise two possibilities: 1 a previously unknown half-sibling from my mom before her marriage to my dad or 2 a previously unknown half-uncle from my maternal grandfather child out of wedlock. So I do think the age factor rules out his being a half-uncle.

I have a small family and all immediate members are known. No possibility of an unknown nephew, uncle or first cousin. Should I discreetly get my mom to spit into a test tube and send it in to Ancestry. My full-sibling sister has just sent in her sample and we are awaiting her results. I hate the thought of never knowing who this person is. Would they be willing to help you? Her share with him might be a more definitive amount.

Paternal half sisters would share the entire X chromosome. Sounds like yours is in the middle, which would suggest 1C. FYI, the link to the online plot digitizer in your post is broken. This is a working link. I do have matches with folks who descend from two of my major lineages i. Yes, the strength of the match has me thinking that something hidden must be there. I have all lines documented at the 2nd grandparent level and beyond except for my direct patrilineal 2nd great-grandfather.

Some more data on possible levels of endogamy—one of my unconnected matches has matches on ancestry at the 3rd cousin level or closer 90 cM shared. Another has 48 such matches. A third, who seems to be LDS ancestry, has 67 such matches. For comparison, my dad has 19 such matches.

It seems that the high number of matches among those DNA cousins suggests that their lines either were very prolific, their descendants are very into genetic genealogy which may be likely for the LDS folks or there was more endogamy than might be obvious from their trees also likely among the LDS folks.

Hi, I am a mom, and I share 3, cm with my son. So am I a chimera or is it just the limitations of the alogrithim? Amounts of cM and above are parent—child. Parent—child comparison can also be distinguished from full sibling ones by the pattern of segment matching.

A parent and child will match on one of their two chromosomes across the entire set of 22 autosomes. I, being a female, share 1, cM across 59 segments with this person, while my Brother shares 1, across 63 segments. He could be your full nephew or full uncle same probability as half sibling or your half nephew or half uncle same probability as first cousin.

The reports also vary for 4th cousins and more distant cousins. Longest segment The results were a big surprise. The man that I knew as my father was not. He passed as well as my mother so I could not get answers. My brothers had their DNA test and the are half siblings. I matched a 1st cousin cM range he put me in contact with his 1st cousin. He ran his test and matched at cM range. For a time I thought that I had found a half sibling and who may have been my bio father he has passed.

My cousins grandfather had 3 sons two of them could not have been my father. Any Thoughts? A match of cM is much more likely to be a first cousin than a half sibling. You might be able to tell for sure by using the WATO tool. So you are comparing a half-nephew against a first cousin relationship? If you do, then you descend from one of the sons. Another approach is to use WATO, which can often pinpoint what generation the tester is in, i. This is what I have.

I found two more matches. The probabilities of each group of relationships given by my recent AncestryDNA results differ quite a lot from the table on this website: eg. Similarly divergent results apply to all my lesser matches cM, cM, 52 cM etc. Ancestry updated their probabilities when they came out with ThruLines. So does that mean that Figure 5.

Hi What would it mean if my father and his sister share some DNA matches but there are some only she has not him. Some matches she has cm and he has 99cm this makes her a cousin and him a There are matches to people that have links to the 1st cousins as well as my dads sister but not with him. My first guess is that the example you gave is a 2nd cousin or similar to your dad and aunt.

Your aunt shares a bit more than average while your dad shares a bit less. By considering both matches together, we can get a better idea of what the relationship is. According to your chart, is cM away from the maximum of half uncle. I know is closer to the average for full uncle than the maximum of half uncle. However, we have proven with DNA that my grandmother and my half great-uncle had different fathers. A match of cM is well outside the range for a half uncle.

Your email address will not be published. Notify me of follow-up comments by email. Notify me of new posts by email. This site uses Akismet to reduce spam. Learn how your comment data is processed. Skip to content. December 19, thednageek d Comments.

Shared centimorgan ranges for different relationship groups. Distributions of shared centimorgans for different relationship categories based on simulated data. Figure 5. For example, between cM and cM, the most probable relationship is Group E, but the full range for that group is 65— cM see below.

Best EJ. You can use AddThis. Pingback: Assistance Needed! Thanks for the extended discussion; it has clarified a lot for me. But, here is my logic. Perhaps you can elaborate in a future blog post? I need to to thank you for this good read!! I definitely enjoyed every little bit of it. What do you think? Nice work! This is very interesting. Like I said, no easy answers. I wish there were.

If one can speak of a number of centimorgans, the correct term is quantity. I applied these numbers to a family tree chart. Where can I share the image? Thank You. Our mutual grandparents were full siblings. My question is: what would the expected shared range be given that scenario? I would first consider how related two children of full siblings would be. My background is UK, so endogamy ought not to be an issue.

This is very handy, as is the probability calculator on the DNAPainter site. That said, I am mystified by your conclusion that the existing results are close to a toss-up. You can email me at theDNAgeek —a— gmail. What would you like added? Can three-quarter siblings and other odd results be added to the chart?

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